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[00:00:00] Hello Alex here. Before you listen to episode 3 of Who Moved the Tortoise, I just wanted to say that this is our first remotely recorded episode and unfortunately a few sound gremlins have crept in along the way. It won't happen again I promise.
[00:00:15] Also there are some fairly dodgy French accents in this episode which I'd like to blame on the audio problems but to be honest they were all down to Ed. Enjoy!
[00:00:33] All I knew was I wanted to try and understand the way the world works, the natural world.
[00:00:50] Science is the storytelling of our time.
[00:00:53] So me storytelling has always been the way to leave sorrow.
[00:00:59] Hello and welcome to Who Moved the Tortoise, a podcast about science and wildlife filmmaking. I'm Kate Dooley
[00:01:08] And I'm Alex Hemingway.
[00:01:10] And as usual we're joined by someone from the world of science or wildlife filmmaking to talk about the film or TV show that inspired them.
[00:01:18] This time we're talking to director and series producer Ed Booth. Having dropped out of primary school at the age of 8 due to dyslexia, Ed followed his maritime fantasy by making a 12 foot sailing dinghy at school, a feat that gained him A-levels in woodwork and navigation.
[00:01:34] He left a yacht and boatyard management course and sailed off to study international relations at the University of Sussex in a mature and unqualified entrance scheme.
[00:01:43] The next dream boat he followed took the form of a woman who was part of the film and video maker society at university.
[00:01:50] The girl never turned up but it was here that his TV career began. He's worked in drama, history, arts, obsdoc, adventure, engineering and science TV.
[00:02:01] Making horizon, tomorrow's world, bangos the theory, salvage squad and gold rush.
[00:02:07] Ed's choice for the film or series that inspired him is the 1968 undersea world of Jacques Cousteau episode, Savage World of the Coral Jungle.
[00:02:17] 10pm on the 20th day of April, longitude 47 degrees east, latitude 10 degrees south, depth 80 feet below the level of the sea. This is the Coral Jungle.
[00:02:38] So Ed, this 12 foot dinghy, were you building this in an attempt to go off and join Jacques Cousteau and the gang?
[00:02:45] Probably not, no. It just seemed like a good idea at the time. Most things I do seem like a good idea at the time.
[00:02:54] But yeah, it's odd actually, I was just thinking about it because I just loved those Jacques Cousteau films.
[00:02:59] I mean, I don't know where they were on. Let's say they were on Wednesday night. Wednesday night was the big night of the week for me.
[00:03:04] Everyone else was waiting for Friday and 5-5 and Crack a Jack. I was waiting for Wednesday and 7.30 and Jacques Cousteau.
[00:03:11] But oddly, the one thing I've really never done in my life is dived. I've sailed the Atlantic twice. I've done this, I've done that.
[00:03:18] I've never really dived. I mean not proper scuba diving which is very strange.
[00:03:24] So I don't think I was building the dinghy to follow Jacques Cousteau either.
[00:03:27] But I do find that thinking about it now a little odd actually because there's no doubt about it. Those films were my life.
[00:03:33] Certainly my Wednesday evenings for many a year.
[00:03:36] So is this an easy choice then?
[00:03:38] It was a no-brainer. I mean, as soon as Kate mentioned it all of a sudden I could hear that.
[00:03:43] Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I mean the great thing about Jacques Cousteau is you only got to watch the first 30 seconds and basically it's Thunderbirds.
[00:03:50] You know, this is Thunderbirds. Real. There's no strings. The little submarine is real and they're flying and there's the boat and then sometimes they go to these crazy coral atles that look just like Tracy Island.
[00:04:02] I suppose it's the perfect graduation. You know, if you've been obsessed by Thunderbirds when you were 7 and then it's not quite as a hit when you're sort of 12 or 13.
[00:04:10] You can kind of sashay into Cousteau and you're still watching Thunderbirds but it's real.
[00:04:15] And also your mum thinks it's kind of good because it's educational.
[00:04:21] Equipped with camera and radio, Philippe Cousteau rides the wind to Surveillantal.
[00:04:37] From the balloon, Philippe reports that there appears to be a dangerously narrow entrance through the fringing reef into a perfect lagoon.
[00:04:44] Calypso steams for the slot.
[00:04:52] So who is 13 year old Ed at this point watching these films?
[00:04:57] Well, he's certainly a dreamer so no great change there.
[00:05:00] I mean, I suppose you know, you kind of look at those films and you just want to be one of those guys.
[00:05:09] And it was a very looking back on it and looking at the episode now, the very male environment.
[00:05:15] Apparently, reading a little bit about Cousteau etc. His wife was the brains behind power.
[00:05:23] She kept it all together and she's on the ship all the time in fact more than him but you never see her.
[00:05:28] She was very camera shy. She didn't have anything to do with that but she actually in terms of keeping that ship alive
[00:05:33] and keeping the boat guys alive and keeping everything going, well, Jacques was off raising money and doing that and doing that.
[00:05:38] She was through them but she never turns up on the shows.
[00:05:41] It's a shame that isn't it because it is just a lot of guys in very short shorts and pipes.
[00:05:46] I wasn't going to mention the short shorts.
[00:05:48] That sounds like your dream film isn't it, Kate?
[00:05:54] If you liked Tan Young Men, this is a place to go but that's the other amazing thing about it.
[00:06:00] Cousteau is permanently old. You look at really early films that he did in the 1950s.
[00:06:06] He looks identical. He's sort of scrawny, not an ounce of fat on him, bastard.
[00:06:11] He just never grows old but he never grows young either.
[00:06:14] So yeah, surround yourself with young men and that's the way to go.
[00:06:18] I'll try and give us a bit of context time-wise and timeline-wise here.
[00:06:23] So this series follows on already from huge success of standalone documentaries that have won him a palm door
[00:06:31] at the Cannes Film Festival which is only one of two documentaries ever to do that
[00:06:35] and he's won Academy Awards for his documentaries as well.
[00:06:39] He is by any measure at this stage a global superstar, isn't he?
[00:06:44] The guy's life is absolutely incredible.
[00:06:47] We've got biggles with all these daring do.
[00:06:49] I mean, Jacques Cousteau is a real-life French biggles, apart from the fact he didn't fly
[00:06:53] and the reason he didn't fly was he was actually training to be a pilot.
[00:06:56] That's what he really wanted to do. He had no interest in diving
[00:06:59] but then in the early 30s he had a horrific car crash
[00:07:04] and was left with dozens of broken bones including an arm that was completely smashed up.
[00:07:10] I saw some x-rays on the film about him and it's just like, bust there, bust there, bust there.
[00:07:14] The surgeon was saying the best thing we can do is cut it off and he said,
[00:07:17] not able to keep my arm.
[00:07:19] So they patched him up and someone suggested, you know what, if you go swimming
[00:07:24] that's probably the best physio you can have and that is really how he transferred into the water
[00:07:29] and then met, he was in the Navy and met some people who were into kind of free diving
[00:07:33] and the rest is they say, he's hysteria, you know?
[00:07:36] So in another universe he would have been pioneering aerial filming and aerial photography
[00:07:41] and the amazing ways to film stuff from the skies.
[00:07:44] Yes, exactly. And it would have been much more boring.
[00:07:47] I suppose if he'd been American he'd probably been an astronaut.
[00:07:51] That's the kind of dude he was. He was in that class.
[00:07:55] But yeah, thanks to a car crash he ended up in the water.
[00:07:58] And yeah, and then he invents, well, co-invents the aqualung
[00:08:03] or rather the actual demand valve which makes the aqualung possible.
[00:08:07] In fact, I believe he gave the name Aqualung is his he coined it.
[00:08:16] The submerged decompression chamber facilitates deep diving
[00:08:20] for the major problem does not involve going down but coming back.
[00:08:24] To make the ascent safer, more comfortable and faster.
[00:08:27] The ponderous SDC is used.
[00:08:30] Lowered in water at the depth where the deep divers should stop their ascent
[00:08:34] for the first decompression stage. It serves as a way stop.
[00:08:41] Early in his career I think he, and he regrets it later
[00:08:44] he took a lot of money from the oil industry
[00:08:46] and did an awful lot of kind of underwater exploration for them
[00:08:50] and made some films about it.
[00:08:51] That's where his base money was.
[00:08:53] But always from the get go he was filming which is interesting.
[00:08:56] So even way back in the early 1940s and early 1950s
[00:09:00] and was shooting which is why there's some great stuff of him
[00:09:03] as a young man still looking 55 but officially young.
[00:09:09] So yeah, it was in his blood.
[00:09:10] His first short film was in 1942
[00:09:12] and he was making short films all the way through the 40s
[00:09:15] and into the 50s.
[00:09:16] And actually one of his three Oscars was for a short film.
[00:09:21] 56 for the silent world
[00:09:23] which wasn't itself without controversy because there were
[00:09:27] shall we say some of the production methods were perhaps ecologically unsound.
[00:09:32] Using TNT to blow up a section of coral reef was involved at some stage.
[00:09:38] For all of that controversy his experience making that film
[00:09:42] made him pivot hard to environmentalism.
[00:09:46] The Islanders have only one source of construction material
[00:09:50] their own fringing reef.
[00:09:52] They harvest coral all year round to use as stones and to make cement.
[00:09:58] It may help build houses but it reduces the natural protection
[00:10:03] offered by the fringing reef against the waves of the ocean.
[00:10:08] What I really noticed about the film watching it again
[00:10:11] and I have to say I picked it at random because they all blurred into one
[00:10:14] I just thought this got a great title and I watched it
[00:10:18] and I thought I don't need to watch anymore this sums up everything that Shax is.
[00:10:21] He doesn't shy away from anything it's pretty brutal what you see on film
[00:10:26] and would you make those films now?
[00:10:29] In that way would you pick up a poor little fish
[00:10:32] and stick it on an anemone to see how the fish gets paralysed
[00:10:37] but they just stuck it in and said oh you know these little fish
[00:10:40] the clown fish can live there but does any other fish goes in
[00:10:43] it gets paralysed
[00:10:45] and then they kind of say but we saved it we did not leave it to die
[00:10:48] so we let it swim away but oh the other fish
[00:10:51] immediately they see there is something wrong with these fish
[00:10:53] and they come and say eat it
[00:10:55] and you see all that and you think blimey
[00:10:57] nature is raw in tooth and core
[00:11:00] but it was yeah it was very Darwinian that film I think.
[00:11:05] A century ago Charles Darwin peered into the waters of a reef
[00:11:10] longing to observe the incredible variety of life below
[00:11:15] but only recently diving scientists have begun solving the
[00:11:20] riddles that confronted Darwin bringing understanding of the coral world
[00:11:25] and the full dimension of its spectacle.
[00:11:29] It was interesting that he referenced Darwin
[00:11:32] and they talk a lot about evolution at the very beginning
[00:11:34] they really lock this this is an adventure film
[00:11:37] but they lock it very closely into science don't they?
[00:11:40] Absolutely I think very much so I mean
[00:11:42] the exclamation about how you know the fish shoal
[00:11:45] by feeling sort of shock waves along their lateral fins
[00:11:48] they're just like oh this is you know this is
[00:11:51] and funny as a kid I don't really remember that
[00:11:53] I just remember those beautiful bronze bodies
[00:11:56] no the fish I remember the fish not the shoals
[00:12:00] but I don't remember the science per se
[00:12:02] I remember the adventure I think that's what I was watching it for
[00:12:05] and it's interesting you know I haven't really gone into
[00:12:07] you know I've picked a natural history film
[00:12:10] but if you actually look at the films I made
[00:12:12] they do tend to slew towards sort of engineering
[00:12:14] and I was probably much more interested in the ship
[00:12:17] and the submarine and you know all those kind of things
[00:12:21] than the actual what it did so yes less interested in the sea
[00:12:25] and more interested in the machines.
[00:12:27] Did you watch it in colour Ed when you first watched it?
[00:12:30] Do you remember?
[00:12:31] I guess not interesting enough actually
[00:12:34] I do very I do remember when we first got our colour TV
[00:12:38] and my mother had gone out and bought it
[00:12:40] or I think on those days you kind of hired them didn't you
[00:12:43] you rented them anyway she'd rented a colour TV
[00:12:46] without telling us and we got back from school
[00:12:48] and she said oh there's something good on the telly boys
[00:12:51] and so me and my little brother's kind of all sat down
[00:12:54] and she demonstrated this new TV that was going to be very exciting
[00:12:57] and then she'd got this great idea that she'd better switch it on
[00:13:00] and we go wow it's in colour
[00:13:02] what was it was David Attenborough down in the South Pole with penguins
[00:13:06] I mean you couldn't get more black and white than that
[00:13:10] I do remember that so I guess
[00:13:13] I guess the early ones I probably did see in black and white
[00:13:15] because it probably went over the sort of transition
[00:13:17] because I mean colour TV into most paper tones came around sort of 1970-71
[00:13:23] by the time people were really getting the men mass
[00:13:25] even though they've been transmitting before that
[00:13:27] so I probably saw the early shows in black and white
[00:13:32] and then yes full glorious colour came a bit later
[00:13:35] now this episode I can't remember whether it's in colour or not
[00:13:38] I can give us a bit more date context actually
[00:13:40] both in terms of that colour TV transition
[00:13:43] which it was BBC2 that went first and that was 67
[00:13:47] and ITV and BBC1 didn't go until 69
[00:13:51] just to rewind a little bit
[00:13:53] the undersea world of Jack Cousteau is an American production for ABC
[00:13:58] this is only the second episode of I think 37
[00:14:02] that kind of spanned virtually a decade
[00:14:04] but this particular episode aired in America on March 6th 1968
[00:14:09] and then through the wonders of the BBC genome website
[00:14:13] I've been able to find the Radio Times entries
[00:14:16] and I say entries in plural
[00:14:18] because this possibly may help you work out when you first saw it
[00:14:22] it was broadcast on BBC2 first in the UK
[00:14:26] between Christmas and New Year the 29th of December
[00:14:28] and it wasn't a Wednesday it was a Sunday night 8.15pm
[00:14:32] and then it was repeated but it wasn't repeated
[00:14:35] it was virtually a full year
[00:14:37] and then on BBC1 on the 14th of December 69
[00:14:40] so in theory from what I can gather
[00:14:43] they would both have been colour broadcasts
[00:14:45] but whether you had a colour TV to watch them
[00:14:48] not in 69 we didn't that's for sure
[00:14:51] yeah that's for sure didn't in 69
[00:14:53] and interestingly actually just to muddy the water a little bit then
[00:14:57] did I see it on BBC1 or BBC2
[00:15:00] because in the part of Scotland that I was then living, Galloway
[00:15:05] we only got BBC1 and ITV for a heck of a long time
[00:15:09] BBC2 didn't we just couldn't do it
[00:15:11] and then at some point and I can't quite remember
[00:15:13] they switched the transmitter on
[00:15:15] and this little rural area of Scotland
[00:15:17] I think we were the last people to get BBC2
[00:15:20] Who would you have been sitting down to watch it with?
[00:15:22] I guess my mum would have probably been trying to get my brothers to bed
[00:15:26] who were younger than me
[00:15:28] and part me in front of the telly because yeah 8.15 he's 9 years old now then
[00:15:32] you can stay up a little bit
[00:15:35] and it would have been very much, yeah
[00:15:37] there would probably be a cup of cocoa in my hand
[00:15:39] and I might well have been wearing a rather smeggy old dressing gown
[00:15:44] and pyjamas
[00:15:48] And you were already interested in engineering at that time
[00:15:51] you were already interesting in machines
[00:15:53] and that was something that came later from watching shows like this
[00:15:56] Yes I think more from watching shows like that
[00:15:59] yeah I mean I didn't have, because ok I had a single parent family
[00:16:02] so I didn't really have a kind of male role model
[00:16:05] although I mean you mentioned at the front that I kind of
[00:16:08] rather spectacularly dropped out of primary school
[00:16:10] that's maybe pushing it a bit
[00:16:11] well actually not pushing it a bit
[00:16:12] I refused to go
[00:16:14] and there was a period
[00:16:16] when my mum was desperate trying to work out what to do with me
[00:16:19] that she got fed up of taking me kicking and screaming to the school gates
[00:16:22] and watching me sprint right through the school to the gate at the back
[00:16:25] and out the other side and basically disappeared for the day
[00:16:29] but she used to give me money, a couple of shillings or something
[00:16:32] because we were living in London then
[00:16:34] to go up to the Science Museum and all the Natural History Museum
[00:16:37] and interestingly enough looking back on it
[00:16:40] it's when I was talking to a friend of mine about it just yesterday
[00:16:43] my main memories are of the Science Museum
[00:16:46] and randomly as well
[00:16:48] and I don't know if this keys into my love of Jack Costello or something
[00:16:52] but there is a model
[00:16:54] I haven't been there for about eight or nine years
[00:16:57] but there's a floor where they have all these ship models in the Science Museum
[00:17:01] for some obscure reason
[00:17:02] and there was one of the SS Southampton
[00:17:05] and I used to really like that model
[00:17:07] for some reason
[00:17:08] and I went back ten years ago it's still bloody there
[00:17:11] and I can see nothing particularly special
[00:17:13] about the SS Southampton
[00:17:15] I mean it's a nice model
[00:17:17] it's about six, seven, eight foot long
[00:17:19] there's nothing amazing about it
[00:17:22] but the fact that that is the one thing in the Science Museum
[00:17:25] I can really remember
[00:17:26] and the fact that when I went back to the Science Museum
[00:17:28] I thought I must go and check that model out
[00:17:30] but there you go
[00:17:31] so maybe there was a kind of interest in engineering
[00:17:33] right from the beginning and ships
[00:17:35] I mean I should say that we actually lived on a boat
[00:17:38] so I was surrounded by boats
[00:17:40] we lived on a converted Thames barge
[00:17:42] which was moored on Chiswick Mall
[00:17:44] in London
[00:17:46] so it's kind of quite natural for me to be into boats
[00:17:48] I suppose
[00:17:49] and the clips though it's fantastic
[00:17:52] Jacques Cousteau didn't actually own it
[00:17:54] it was owned by a Guinness
[00:17:56] fortune person
[00:17:58] who bought it for Cousteau to use
[00:18:00] and charged him I think one franc a year
[00:18:02] and I believe it ended up in some rather nasty little legal thing
[00:18:05] right at the end as to who actually
[00:18:07] whether the Cousteau Foundation own it or Mr Guinness
[00:18:10] and the fact you're drinking again is whilst recording this podcast
[00:18:13] a non-alcoholic Guinness I hasten to add
[00:18:15] and just to really muddy the waters
[00:18:18] it's in a stela to our glass
[00:18:20] shall we dive in?
[00:18:30] no pun intended
[00:18:31] dive into the film itself
[00:18:33] yes I think we need to swim deeper into this subject
[00:18:35] obviously I'm hugely aware of Jacques Cousteau
[00:18:38] but have not seen much of his stuff
[00:18:40] I guess I'm a little bit too young to have caught any of it
[00:18:42] the first time round
[00:18:43] I loved it
[00:18:44] I loved the whole thing
[00:18:45] and my overriding impression
[00:18:47] was that all of the layers of adventure
[00:18:50] and engineering and science
[00:18:52] and expedition
[00:18:53] all of those multiple layers that are going on
[00:18:56] as well as the natural history
[00:18:57] it all felt very real
[00:18:59] and I think we
[00:19:01] I think at times we are often trying to inject elements
[00:19:03] of all of those things into our films
[00:19:05] depending on what we're making
[00:19:07] but we're trying to create the artifice of a journey
[00:19:09] or the artifice of an expedition
[00:19:11] to give it that flavour
[00:19:13] but this is real
[00:19:14] this you are seeing these things really unfold
[00:19:17] in front of you
[00:19:18] it felt hugely rewarding and exciting
[00:19:21] as a viewer to kind of dip into that
[00:19:23] the passion and the energy
[00:19:25] really came across
[00:19:26] because it's literally fly on the wall
[00:19:28] you're seeing it happen
[00:19:29] we'd make it very differently today
[00:19:32] but in a way all you're trying to do is recreate
[00:19:35] the energy and passion that this film naturally has
[00:19:39] what's interesting about that
[00:19:40] it's all beautifully fly on the wall
[00:19:42] but there's one little bit
[00:19:43] about five six minutes in something like that
[00:19:45] near the head of the show
[00:19:46] where all of a sudden
[00:19:47] he just suddenly turns into a totally naff presenter
[00:19:50] and does this sort of piece to camera
[00:19:52] and it you know
[00:19:54] not only is he not very good at it
[00:19:56] it also kind of slightly shatters the whole illusion
[00:19:59] of the thing
[00:20:00] because everything else has got this
[00:20:02] American voiceover on it
[00:20:04] and you just hear these guys speaking French
[00:20:06] you know
[00:20:07] Couste never speaks English to you
[00:20:09] or anything
[00:20:10] and then suddenly there's this naff little bit
[00:20:11] for about
[00:20:12] it's only about five or six seconds
[00:20:13] where he basically addresses the camera
[00:20:15] and I think it must be the bridge of the calypso or something
[00:20:18] and explains something
[00:20:19] and it's just like
[00:20:20] oh come on
[00:20:21] you don't see that much of him elsewhere
[00:20:23] doing all these tests
[00:20:24] you never see him diving in the water
[00:20:26] it's always on the people
[00:20:27] so you only see him has this
[00:20:29] he's the lead of this exploration
[00:20:32] but you don't see him particularly
[00:20:34] with his men
[00:20:35] and see that relationship they have
[00:20:37] you only get one reference to that later
[00:20:39] in the film when they've been in the big
[00:20:41] they were kind of super deep dive
[00:20:43] and they come back up and he says this is when I really worry about my men
[00:20:46] but otherwise you kind of don't
[00:20:48] you don't see that bond that they must have
[00:20:51] which is interesting isn't it
[00:20:52] why did they choose to make the film that way
[00:20:54] with him so separate
[00:20:55] and talking in English down the barrel of the lens
[00:20:58] I don't know
[00:20:59] it is interesting
[00:21:00] it's interesting what you say about
[00:21:01] you know they really worry about the deep dive
[00:21:03] and the decompression
[00:21:05] because he lost
[00:21:06] in the very early days of diving
[00:21:08] he lost a diver
[00:21:09] when people didn't really know about the bends
[00:21:11] and they were doing research basically
[00:21:14] they wanted to get down to something like
[00:21:16] 300 meters or something ridiculous
[00:21:18] and they kind of
[00:21:19] this poor chap went down and came back up
[00:21:21] and was dead within a day
[00:21:23] as you say Alex
[00:21:24] that you really get the feeling that you're going on a
[00:21:26] you're almost like one of the crew
[00:21:28] and you kind of feel that
[00:21:30] yeah you're going on an expedition with them
[00:21:32] and the expeditions you never quite know
[00:21:34] I mean they do a lot of science
[00:21:35] there's no doubt about it
[00:21:37] but you're not quite sure what the science is really for
[00:21:39] whether it's just for the camera
[00:21:41] or part of some great big research thing
[00:21:43] that's real I don't know
[00:21:45] we have been on the reef for four weeks
[00:21:48] examining life on the ocean floor
[00:21:50] now to set up a new experiment in fish behavior
[00:21:54] we must collect living samples
[00:22:00] it's about science communication
[00:22:02] and conservation
[00:22:03] and more public awareness
[00:22:05] than real hard science
[00:22:08] there is that kind of balance I thought
[00:22:10] between entertainment and science
[00:22:12] along the whole show
[00:22:14] they did so much
[00:22:15] and they were so cutting edge
[00:22:16] they were so far ahead of anybody else at that time
[00:22:19] that I think the science is genuine
[00:22:21] and I think the science must have been worthwhile
[00:22:24] to someone to draw on it
[00:22:26] because it wasn't being done anywhere else
[00:22:28] and you know some of the kit they had
[00:22:30] the kind of macro photography
[00:22:33] they did of the little shrimp
[00:22:35] and when all that kit is built by them
[00:22:38] it's quite amazing actually
[00:22:40] with specialized equipment
[00:22:45] not only sounds but sights too
[00:22:47] can be recorded in their most minute detail
[00:22:50] here 30 feet beneath the surface
[00:22:52] an aquatic motion picture studio
[00:22:55] roof to screen out natural illumination
[00:22:58] equipped with lights, camera and plenty of action
[00:23:01] it is called macro photography
[00:23:03] the close up study of a seemingly empty
[00:23:05] plot of land on the ocean floor
[00:23:08] that with time and patience
[00:23:10] it was a wealth of hidden animal life
[00:23:12] I've done quite a bit of macro
[00:23:17] even today it's an intensely fiddly
[00:23:19] experience at the best of times
[00:23:21] but doing it in the ocean
[00:23:23] 56 years ago
[00:23:25] and to get the results they were getting
[00:23:27] it was absolutely remarkable
[00:23:30] and that's just one facet of what they were doing
[00:23:32] they then bring out that
[00:23:34] the whole decompression chamber thing
[00:23:36] that whole scene towards the end of the film
[00:23:38] they've just got one toy after another
[00:23:40] and these are all things
[00:23:42] they've invented, he's thought of
[00:23:44] and a lot of the time you kind of think
[00:23:46] well this toy is just used for the film
[00:23:48] that film opens up with
[00:23:50] his son, Philippe
[00:23:52] going on this one man balloon thing
[00:23:54] to up above the atel
[00:23:56] to slow-cord guide the ship in
[00:23:58] I think, yeah right
[00:24:00] didn't really need to do that but on the other hand
[00:24:02] I wish I was Mr. Philippe
[00:24:04] dangling down below
[00:24:06] it really felt like that there
[00:24:08] on this voyage of discovery
[00:24:10] they've got bands so like
[00:24:12] Scott and Shackleton they would have their own
[00:24:14] newspaper, they'd have their own bands
[00:24:16] because they're going to be away for months
[00:24:18] at a time from their families
[00:24:20] and similarly we see
[00:24:22] one of the bands, they have several
[00:24:24] it feels quite
[00:24:26] golden age of adventure
[00:24:28] but also quite rock and roll
[00:24:32] July 12th
[00:24:34] four months at sea
[00:24:36] and it seems as if the work has just begun
[00:24:52] the jam sessions
[00:24:54] on board Calypso take many forms
[00:24:56] and express many moods
[00:24:58] among the men there are separate musical groups
[00:25:00] a classical string quartet
[00:25:02] a rock and roll band
[00:25:04] and a group that plays modern jazz
[00:25:06] yeah I mean it's an interesting one
[00:25:10] the other interesting thing about it
[00:25:12] I'm just kind of wondering why I as a little kid
[00:25:14] kind of related to it because he's got
[00:25:16] his two sons there
[00:25:18] and he is the ultimate dad figure isn't he
[00:25:20] you know he looks wrinkly and old like your dad
[00:25:22] I mean my dad wasn't really around but
[00:25:24] I wonder if that kind of sucked
[00:25:26] people you know myself and others in
[00:25:28] but yeah I mean he you know
[00:25:30] the ultimate dad
[00:25:32] would you have liked the red beanie
[00:25:34] I mean that looked pretty good doesn't it
[00:25:36] I wonder what the story is there
[00:25:38] I suppose it makes them stand out
[00:25:40] but it's the closest they got to a uniform
[00:25:42] so the red beanie
[00:25:44] is from those kind of
[00:25:46] first diving suits that had their copper
[00:25:48] helmets and they had to
[00:25:50] have like a hat on
[00:25:52] for two reasons I think one
[00:25:54] is all the cold air is coming in
[00:25:56] so you have to have a hat to keep you warm
[00:25:58] and the other thing of course
[00:26:00] you know me and the other thing is
[00:26:02] I think there's some kind of valve maybe up
[00:26:04] there that you're hitting on and off with your head
[00:26:06] and so it wouldn't get you bruised
[00:26:08] so when they actually sold the people who made
[00:26:10] these suits sold them they sold them
[00:26:12] with a red beanie hat
[00:26:14] and so I think it's this kind of
[00:26:16] history
[00:26:18] of them that's interesting
[00:26:20] that then he's kind of followed and he's like
[00:26:22] paying homage to the kind of the
[00:26:24] first early divers that pioneered
[00:26:26] but put their lives on the line to pioneer
[00:26:28] that red beanie
[00:26:30] trope is carried over to the
[00:26:32] Wes Anderson isn't it the film
[00:26:34] the life aquatic with Steve Zizou
[00:26:36] which is essentially a
[00:26:38] it's kind of part homage
[00:26:40] and part parody of Jacques Cousteau
[00:26:42] and if you've seen it you'll know
[00:26:44] if you've seen the poster
[00:26:46] the red beanie is in there
[00:26:48] the red beanie is there
[00:26:50] a wider point there
[00:26:52] I think it's a measure of
[00:26:54] you know you're in the upper echelons
[00:26:56] of stardom when there are
[00:26:58] films made like that they're essentially
[00:27:00] an homage to your life
[00:27:02] there are songs written about you
[00:27:04] John Denver wrote a song called Calypso
[00:27:06] R.E.M wrote a song about him called
[00:27:08] Narator
[00:27:16] I'm a woman, I'm a shanty
[00:27:24] you may be too young to remember
[00:27:26] the wonderful kids cartoon Rubar van Custard
[00:27:28] no I remember it
[00:27:30] there was lots where Custard
[00:27:32] would be Jacques Cousteau
[00:27:34] he called himself
[00:27:36] there were lots of ones when he went
[00:27:38] diving in the pond as Jacques Cousteau
[00:27:40] so yeah, so you got Wes Anderson
[00:27:42] and Rubar van Cousteau
[00:27:44] I'd be more honoured to be in Rubar van Custard
[00:27:46] that would be really good
[00:27:48] that would be really good
[00:27:50] that's brilliant
[00:28:13] what did it feel like watching it back
[00:28:15] well do you know here's a really weird thing
[00:28:17] I think there are two Ed Booths
[00:28:19] the Ed Booth will sit in an edit suite
[00:28:21] and will take something
[00:28:23] apart and there's the Ed Booth
[00:28:25] that can even watch his own films
[00:28:27] like 10 years later and they just
[00:28:29] I just think
[00:28:31] I don't really think
[00:28:33] I'm just there and I go on the ride
[00:28:35] like any other viewer
[00:28:37] I mean I was incredibly impressed with some of the kid
[00:28:41] and just thinking about how long it must have taken
[00:28:43] just to get those shots
[00:28:45] and how actually you know it's incredibly fly
[00:28:47] on the wall but it's all very worked out
[00:28:49] I mean it's interesting
[00:28:51] I've been working on Gold Brush White Water
[00:28:53] which is a show that's made out
[00:28:55] in Alaska where you've got these
[00:28:57] guys diving for gold
[00:28:59] it's about the closest I've ever got to doing Jacuzzo
[00:29:01] the amount of kit that we need
[00:29:03] to be able to film these guys
[00:29:05] is unbelievable, the amount of thinking about it
[00:29:07] alright so what's the deal
[00:29:09] you're gonna have to stand by
[00:29:11] we're working on getting the bugs out of this thing
[00:29:13] deep in a remote Alaskan canyon
[00:29:17] Gold Rush veterans Fred Hurd
[00:29:19] and his son Dustin
[00:29:21] the Dakota Boats
[00:29:23] are back
[00:29:25] searching for gold
[00:29:27] so the way Gold Rush works is
[00:29:32] you've got a team
[00:29:34] there were eight miners working on two sites
[00:29:36] very close to each other on the same creek
[00:29:38] the wonderful name Nugget Creek
[00:29:40] and we didn't name it Nugget Creek
[00:29:42] it really was called Nugget Creek
[00:29:44] and they're out there
[00:29:46] for six months as soon as the snow in the ice
[00:29:48] begins to go they're there
[00:29:50] and they stay there until the snow in the ice comes back
[00:29:52] and they're literally in the water
[00:29:54] five, six days a week
[00:29:56] diving away and most of it
[00:29:58] is moving rocks
[00:30:00] and it's a very
[00:30:02] very sort of visceral show
[00:30:04] but
[00:30:06] what's amusing about it is that
[00:30:08] it really is most of it's moving rocks
[00:30:10] and then getting disappointed because you finally hit
[00:30:12] bedrock and there's really hardly any gold there
[00:30:14] and we made
[00:30:16] 17 hours of that top rating show
[00:30:18] and the story
[00:30:20] the story basically every week is the same
[00:30:22] we're gonna get rich guys
[00:30:24] hey we're almost there guys
[00:30:26] god damn it
[00:30:28] we're a bedrock guys
[00:30:30] oh there's no gold
[00:30:32] well tomorrow
[00:30:34] so how are you filming that
[00:30:36] we don't interfere in any way shape or form
[00:30:38] we do not direct we can't direct
[00:30:40] because these guys are taking such horrendous risks
[00:30:42] that if we kind of said ah be really kind of good
[00:30:44] if you kind of
[00:30:46] just were a little bit closer to that rock when you
[00:30:48] blasted it so like we could see the rocks going past you
[00:30:50] if you did that
[00:30:52] you know we would be responsible for their deaths
[00:30:54] and actually you don't need to because they're always
[00:30:56] far too close to the bloody rocks
[00:30:58] so the way it works is we have
[00:31:00] one PD who's basically
[00:31:02] with each of the teams filming everything all the time
[00:31:06] and asking them questions as they're doing it
[00:31:08] hey why are you doing this, why are you doing that etc etc
[00:31:10] the guys have got various
[00:31:12] go-pros on them on bodycams etc
[00:31:14] both you know
[00:31:16] on their chests, on the diving gear
[00:31:18] inside the
[00:31:20] face masks all the sort of thing
[00:31:22] we then do have a dive
[00:31:24] cameraman who goes down with them
[00:31:26] and gets in the way and is generally hated
[00:31:28] the brilliant Nigel Dupont
[00:31:30] who must have a skin thicker than everybody else
[00:31:32] because they just you know he's always kind of
[00:31:34] like you know kicking up dust
[00:31:36] whether they don't want it or bump they're bumping into him
[00:31:38] or they want to get the dredge there
[00:31:40] because it's going to be the biggest nugget ever
[00:31:42] and then all of a sudden Nigel's there with his camera
[00:31:44] and they can't get the drainer
[00:31:46] so he's in the water with them quite a lot
[00:31:48] and then we have
[00:31:50] dedicated go-pro
[00:31:52] drone pilots who are flying
[00:31:54] and buzzing around so
[00:31:56] there's an awful lot of footage
[00:31:58] I mean it is a bit like Jacques Cousteau
[00:32:00] they generate massive amounts of footage
[00:32:02] and this is all on
[00:32:04] incredibly remote
[00:32:06] it's a 30 minute
[00:32:08] 20 minute helicopter ride
[00:32:10] from the nearest road
[00:32:12] so you're talking remote
[00:32:14] there's about 25 people up on this camp
[00:32:16] 25 people
[00:32:18] about 300 bears
[00:32:20] and
[00:32:22] I have to say that Raw have just done
[00:32:24] an amazing job on the technical side of it
[00:32:26] so we can be filming out there
[00:32:28] and
[00:32:30] basically we you know back up all the rushes
[00:32:32] and then we spend proxies
[00:32:34] which are bounced off of a
[00:32:36] relay station that they've built
[00:32:38] on the top of this mountain
[00:32:40] so it goes up the top of the mountain
[00:32:42] down into Haynes where somebody
[00:32:44] quickly does a sort of final log
[00:32:46] and so literally the next morning
[00:32:48] they're beginning to cut the proxies
[00:32:50] of the show that we shot the day before
[00:32:52] you know we're up to a sort of
[00:32:54] seven or eight nine ten at night
[00:32:56] sort of giving them story lines etc etc
[00:32:58] so it's the most amazing
[00:33:00] technical system
[00:33:02] how long can they be underwater
[00:33:04] because Jacques Cousteau they're filming on film
[00:33:06] but this is different
[00:33:08] no we are literally live all the time
[00:33:10] so the divers, they're not bringing air from tanks
[00:33:12] they're being fed from the
[00:33:14] top
[00:33:16] the water is literally it's glacial melt
[00:33:18] water so it's literally you know about as
[00:33:20] close to freezing as water can be without
[00:33:22] being ice
[00:33:24] so most of them apart from Kayla
[00:33:26] she refuses to wear
[00:33:28] a heated dry suit
[00:33:30] she just goes in the dry suit I mean she's just
[00:33:32] I don't quite what there is for that woman
[00:33:34] but she is tough
[00:33:36] so they're in a dry suit which has got
[00:33:38] hot water being fed to it
[00:33:40] from the dredge basically
[00:33:42] the pumps are all run by little
[00:33:44] two stroke engines and there's a heat
[00:33:46] exchanger on the exhaust so
[00:33:48] that can feed hot water down to the diver
[00:33:50] so once the diver goes down
[00:33:52] they can be down there really until they're
[00:33:54] exhausted and that can be five hours or so
[00:33:56] so they will literally be down there for five hours
[00:33:58] so the cameraman can be down there for
[00:34:00] five hours too, well here's film
[00:34:02] no the camera will pop up and pop down
[00:34:04] but yeah we're filming that entire thing
[00:34:06] okay so he'll film for what like an hour
[00:34:08] battery change the
[00:34:10] yeah he'll film until
[00:34:12] until Carlos or whoever happens to be
[00:34:14] diving is so fed up with Nigel being
[00:34:16] down there he pushes him out of the water
[00:34:18] and then you kind of let them breathe for
[00:34:20] ten minutes and stuff him back in there
[00:34:22] again but I mean remarkably
[00:34:24] there's really very little
[00:34:26] visibility down there
[00:34:28] so there's actually
[00:34:30] strangely not that much to see
[00:34:32] it's quite bizarre yet
[00:34:34] when it's all cut together
[00:34:36] it is it's so well done
[00:34:38] it really works
[00:34:40] and again it does have that feeling
[00:34:42] that you are there, you're one of the guys
[00:34:44] so I suppose that's the closest I've got to
[00:34:46] making a Jacques Cousteau type film
[00:34:48] apart from one other I did a horizon
[00:34:50] which I directed many moons ago
[00:34:52] that sinkholes where we did cave diving
[00:34:54] in Florida which was
[00:34:56] incredible but that
[00:34:58] literally we watched a bunch
[00:35:00] of cave divers go down
[00:35:02] and we waited for two hours while they swam
[00:35:04] through this huge long cave
[00:35:06] system and they popped up
[00:35:08] out of another sinkhole
[00:35:10] and then they gave us all their camera
[00:35:12] all their tapes and it was great I was mighty relieved
[00:35:14] when we saw the bubbles bubbling up
[00:35:16] and then we knew that they were alright
[00:35:18] because it's very deadly cave diving
[00:35:20] Do you think there's something
[00:35:22] in diving then them and these
[00:35:24] kind of expeditions that make you feel
[00:35:26] naturally feel like you're one
[00:35:28] of the team or do you think it's something
[00:35:30] in the way they're filmed
[00:35:32] Well I think naturally I would like to be
[00:35:34] one of those people and I would love
[00:35:36] to have gone diving you know
[00:35:38] and all that kind of stuff of course I would
[00:35:40] I don't know if I'd you know probably the
[00:35:42] diving is kind of irrelevant but putting on
[00:35:44] those big rubber suits and that sounds a bit
[00:35:46] weird but all the rest of the kit
[00:35:48] that'd be fine I mean
[00:35:50] I could have put on the kit and wandered around
[00:35:52] the deck so yeah I mean I was there's
[00:35:54] no doubt about it I was I when I was
[00:35:56] watching it on that little now we've worked
[00:35:58] out it probably was black and white telly
[00:36:00] I was I was on that boat
[00:36:02] I would be part of it
[00:36:04] just a quick reference actually because it's
[00:36:06] just something I happen to read earlier today
[00:36:08] and it's kind of in reference to the sheer
[00:36:10] volume of footage that you would be shooting
[00:36:12] on something like Gold Rush your shooting
[00:36:14] ratios must be enormous the feature
[00:36:16] length films that he did before this series
[00:36:18] they were their shooting ratio
[00:36:20] was about 10 to 1
[00:36:22] they shot 25 kilometers
[00:36:24] of film and the
[00:36:26] final cut was two and a half kilometers
[00:36:28] something astonishing like that so
[00:36:30] the discipline of the filmmaking side of it
[00:36:32] that as a technical exercise
[00:36:34] essentially trapped on a boat
[00:36:36] everything has to happen within the confines
[00:36:38] of that vessel I mean
[00:36:40] they couldn't have been developing any of that
[00:36:42] film on the boat I mean maybe they did but you know
[00:36:44] there's huge trust that
[00:36:46] maybe they kind of managed to
[00:36:48] helicopter stuff out and it was taken back and they knew
[00:36:50] two days later if they'd actually got something
[00:36:52] but yeah it must have been
[00:36:54] horrendous I mean it's interesting what we're talking about
[00:36:56] the discipline and the shooting ratios
[00:36:58] etc when I mean I've been
[00:37:00] in this game long enough to
[00:37:02] probably entered it just when
[00:37:04] you know video was really taking over from
[00:37:06] 16 mil and you
[00:37:08] could always tell directors
[00:37:10] who had been kind of trained in the days
[00:37:12] of film as against directors
[00:37:14] who you know they just come along
[00:37:16] and really learn their trade in video
[00:37:20] because and you could you know if you had
[00:37:22] if you had two two young
[00:37:24] produced directors they went out in two different
[00:37:26] shoots and invariably you know
[00:37:28] the classic thing is a series produced
[00:37:30] how did it go everyone will say yeah yeah
[00:37:32] it went really great yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah
[00:37:34] we turned over at like 9 in the morning
[00:37:36] and yeah yeah we were still filming
[00:37:38] about Oposite at night and they
[00:37:40] put this great whopper of about
[00:37:42] 10 tapes down on your desk so yeah
[00:37:44] look we did all that in a day and then
[00:37:46] the one who was killed on film
[00:37:48] you say had it go says oh yeah yeah it went really well
[00:37:50] and so yeah
[00:37:52] we turned over about Oposite
[00:37:54] and we were wrapped
[00:37:56] at about 3 30 and they put
[00:37:58] two tapes down on your desk
[00:38:00] you know which one the better film was
[00:38:02] it was the one on the two tapes
[00:38:04] because every shot on that had been thought about
[00:38:06] because they were used to having you know
[00:38:08] four four minute magazines
[00:38:10] everything was edited
[00:38:12] in their head and they got what they needed
[00:38:14] and nothing else whereas I used to call
[00:38:16] Mr. Hoover's or Mrs. Hoover's
[00:38:18] you know people would just go out there
[00:38:20] and yeah the story is in there somewhere
[00:38:22] and you were running from 9 o'clock
[00:38:24] there's an element to that that you need
[00:38:26] to think these things through there's no doubt about it
[00:38:28] that's my thing of filmmaking I always
[00:38:30] I always think everything through
[00:38:32] and I try to film
[00:38:34] actually as little as possible
[00:38:36] and I also try to be the
[00:38:38] in the edit so if I film too little
[00:38:40] I'm the person who feels
[00:38:42] the pain there's nothing
[00:38:44] no lonelier place than an edit without
[00:38:46] enough rushes but there's no more
[00:38:48] confusing a place than an edit with too much rushes
[00:38:50] so somewhere in between there is the golden
[00:38:52] the perfect
[00:38:54] place to be but I do think there's
[00:38:56] you know there's one of the bad things about
[00:38:58] this whole non-linear world you know this is
[00:39:00] joke that there's no final cut
[00:39:02] just goes on and on forever
[00:39:04] these days where it never used
[00:39:06] to in film and I don't think the films are
[00:39:08] what if you look at Cousteau
[00:39:10] you know those films really
[00:39:12] stand up apart from mutilating
[00:39:14] of small fish
[00:39:16] I don't think anyone would say
[00:39:18] so primitive and shite far from it
[00:39:20] I think
[00:39:22] I thought the scripts were lovely and lyrical
[00:39:24] but also at times very sparse
[00:39:26] which is lovely just to let
[00:39:28] little sequences play out
[00:39:40] each foot they travel represents
[00:39:42] more than a human generation in time
[00:39:44] I can imagine everybody in this conversation
[00:40:00] now has gone into making a film
[00:40:02] with the intention of it
[00:40:04] being very sparse on voiceover
[00:40:06] and then you hit the edit and then you get your notes
[00:40:08] and by the end it's just wall-to-wall
[00:40:10] commentary but this does have
[00:40:12] lots of breathing space in it
[00:40:14] I was trying to put my finger on what I thought
[00:40:16] dated it and for me
[00:40:18] it was one thing really and that was the music
[00:40:20] which I wasn't particularly keen on
[00:40:22] I thought the music at times was quite overbearing
[00:40:24] and trying to force the story a bit too much
[00:40:28] I think the music is really good but I think it's of an era
[00:40:54] and there is something about it
[00:40:56] that might have been a little bit of
[00:40:58] Dallas
[00:41:00] the title sequence of Dallas has got something to do
[00:41:02] with this big bubbly orchestral
[00:41:06] a bit over the top
[00:41:08] I think the music would probably be different
[00:41:10] but as you say everything else
[00:41:12] there would be far too many more drone shots
[00:41:14] that's what you have to do these days
[00:41:16] but I think most of it
[00:41:18] would be very much the same
[00:41:20] having said that
[00:41:22] there was some great science in there
[00:41:24] putting those fish inside those glass domes
[00:41:26] and seeing how the other fish
[00:41:28] realised there was something wrong
[00:41:30] and the kin species came
[00:41:32] and tried to help them out
[00:41:34] and then the attack, the higher up the things
[00:41:36] saw an easy lunch
[00:41:38] fantastic stuff
[00:41:45] Interestingly the first to come to their aid
[00:41:47] are members of the same species
[00:41:49] sensing trouble through the erratic
[00:41:51] swimming behaviour of their imprisoned companions
[00:42:02] One thing I wonder if you would do differently today
[00:42:04] is you had Jacques Cousteau's voice
[00:42:06] and you also had this narrator
[00:42:08] so we were listening to the American
[00:42:10] Rod Sterling
[00:42:12] who has a really interesting
[00:42:14] history but basically
[00:42:16] created the Twilight Zone
[00:42:18] because he was interested
[00:42:20] in these battles that the sensors
[00:42:22] weren't interested in him battling
[00:42:24] and so he
[00:42:26] became very famous for the Twilight Zone
[00:42:28] you know it's unexpected plot twists
[00:42:30] and turns and kind of moral lessons
[00:42:32] but I kind of
[00:42:34] didn't know why you had him and Jacques Cousteau
[00:42:36] and why Jacques Cousteau didn't voice the whole thing
[00:42:38] I just wonder
[00:42:40] whether it was perhaps reflective of
[00:42:42] filmmaking of that time
[00:42:44] and I'd made the same note which was
[00:42:46] if you made it today
[00:42:48] Jacques Cousteau would have narrated the whole thing
[00:42:50] The scripts are very different
[00:42:52] Jacques Cousteau is such a poet
[00:42:54] you know I just
[00:42:56] wrote one line from quite early in the film
[00:42:58] and I'm going to put out on his romantic
[00:43:00] French voice because he kind of got to
[00:43:02] as we descend into the deep
[00:43:04] we are no more explorers but children
[00:43:06] in a store full of sufficies
[00:43:08] I mean that's poetry that is
[00:43:10] you know if I'd written that I'd be frankly amazed
[00:43:12] so much of what he writes
[00:43:14] is poetic I think anyway
[00:43:16] and yet as you say
[00:43:18] the rest of the comm is quite
[00:43:20] serious the
[00:43:22] Rod Sterling stuff
[00:43:37] It had moments of poetry in it
[00:43:39] but it was definitely much more packed
[00:43:42] with facts which today
[00:43:44] every word you write
[00:43:46] is in service of the story
[00:43:48] whereas then you're painting a picture
[00:43:50] and giving context I think
[00:43:52] much more
[00:43:54] It still managed to deliver a very strong
[00:43:56] ecological message though
[00:43:58] it didn't pull any punches I don't think
[00:44:00] No and my understanding
[00:44:02] is that the show eventually got cancelled
[00:44:04] because he got too ecological
[00:44:06] towards the end and
[00:44:08] the broadcasters
[00:44:10] are wanting him to pull back
[00:44:12] from his ecological message and he said
[00:44:14] No it's really good
[00:44:16] from that point of view and so early
[00:44:18] and then you know he went on
[00:44:20] the Jacque Cousteau Foundation etc etc
[00:44:22] and the work that he did later on in his life
[00:44:24] on a kind of governmental level
[00:44:26] was all about ecology
[00:44:28] It was such a rich
[00:44:30] series and the fact that
[00:44:32] I suppose a little bit like Attenborough
[00:44:34] Cousteau himself is larger than
[00:44:36] the show that he's in
[00:44:38] I mean you can
[00:44:40] reel off a few
[00:44:42] you might even put Jeremy Clarkson as another
[00:44:44] kind of person who is
[00:44:46] bigger than the shows that he makes
[00:44:48] and I think that with Cousteau
[00:44:50] that's one of the great things about it
[00:44:52] is that you are watching someone
[00:44:54] that you kind of look on almost as
[00:44:56] not really a god but
[00:44:58] a hero and your hero
[00:45:00] is going to go off on another adventure
[00:45:02] and that's why you watch it
[00:45:04] and certainly for me I just
[00:45:06] I thought Jacque Cousteau was just
[00:45:08] yeah, man walked on water
[00:45:10] Having had the chance
[00:45:12] to re-watch it
[00:45:14] having had the chance to sit and chat about it
[00:45:16] for an hour I just wonder if you could put into your own words
[00:45:18] what that film
[00:45:20] means to you
[00:45:22] I suppose it was very much
[00:45:24] part of my childhood I loved adventure
[00:45:26] I still love adventure
[00:45:28] and you know I was
[00:45:30] reading Jacque Cousteau
[00:45:32] I was reading Swallows and Amazons and there's this element about that
[00:45:34] you know these people who go off to magical places
[00:45:36] and it's so much more
[00:45:38] interesting you know so many people
[00:45:40] at that time were getting off on the moon landings
[00:45:42] etc but that was a place
[00:45:44] you could never go
[00:45:46] but Jacque Cousteau I could see myself going on a boat
[00:45:48] I could do that
[00:45:50] and you know to some I've known I've really been diving
[00:45:52] I've done that
[00:45:54] and it was the same appeal with Swallows and Amazons
[00:45:56] it was kids with a little boat who could go to an island
[00:45:58] and have an amazing adventure
[00:46:00] and so I suppose that's what it meant to me
[00:46:02] but then it kind of rolls over
[00:46:04] probably without my even being in any way aware of it
[00:46:06] into just kind of a general
[00:46:08] fascination of what's possible
[00:46:10] and also an understanding that
[00:46:12] you can do crazy things
[00:46:14] and kind of get away with it
[00:46:16] I think that's the great thing about Jacque Cousteau
[00:46:18] it didn't seem to be any barriers
[00:46:20] you seem to have loads of barriers around you
[00:46:22] and here was this guy who just
[00:46:24] did stuff
[00:46:26] I suppose that was one of the great appeals
[00:46:28] When I think of you Ed
[00:46:30] I think of someone who can do anything
[00:46:32] and will do anything
[00:46:34] and will do crazy things
[00:46:36] I just wonder where the part of
[00:46:38] who you are is reflected in
[00:46:40] in the film we've just watched
[00:46:42] Yeah well I suppose
[00:46:44] the question is you know
[00:46:46] the question of origin
[00:46:48] was I attracted to those films because of who I am
[00:46:50] or am I because
[00:46:52] partly because of those films
[00:46:54] God knows
[00:46:56] I just want to point out that it's very flattering
[00:46:58] what you just said and I am very touched by it
[00:47:00] a man who can do anything
[00:47:02] no I'm a man who thinks he can do anything
[00:47:04] he usually can't he does it anyway
[00:47:06] yeah it's the doing it anyway bit
[00:47:08] that I always loved actually
[00:47:10] yeah they're doing it anyway
[00:47:12] I do think, yeah just do it
[00:47:14] maybe I should learn to dive
[00:47:16] I think you should it's never too late
[00:47:18] I did interestingly
[00:47:20] I have started to learn to dive
[00:47:22] in the day and I had
[00:47:24] a rather traumatic experience
[00:47:26] which stopped me diving
[00:47:28] and it has absolutely
[00:47:30] nothing to do with anything that happened in the water
[00:47:32] I was not really bothered
[00:47:34] Oh no worse than that
[00:47:36] no I was living at home
[00:47:38] and I had to borrow
[00:47:40] my mother's car
[00:47:42] to drive to Dumfries swimming bath
[00:47:44] to the Dumfries Sub-Aqua Club
[00:47:46] to do my training
[00:47:48] and I had a really nice time doing the training
[00:47:50] and I got out
[00:47:52] and I couldn't find
[00:47:54] the car keys
[00:47:56] to get into the car somehow I locked the car keys
[00:47:58] in the car
[00:48:00] and it was very bad news
[00:48:02] and I didn't know what to do and then I had this great
[00:48:04] you know hey I can do anything
[00:48:06] and I think I'd seen someone
[00:48:08] there was a way with old cars that you could
[00:48:10] kind of slip something down inside
[00:48:12] the side window
[00:48:14] and kind of flick the
[00:48:16] mechanism and you could get into the car
[00:48:18] but I didn't have anything to push down
[00:48:20] apart from the aerial of my mother's car
[00:48:22] so I managed to snap the aerial off
[00:48:24] put it down
[00:48:26] and she went ape that I'd snapped the aerial off
[00:48:30] even I bought a new one and fixed it within a week
[00:48:34] and I seriously believe that's why I never
[00:48:36] learnt to dive because I don't think she lent me
[00:48:38] her car again
[00:48:42] so yeah I could have been Jacques Cousteau
[00:48:44] I've got the accent, a little fatter
[00:48:46] but yeah was it not
[00:48:48] you know it's funny how life changes
[00:48:50] one broken aerial and
[00:48:52] there you go
[00:48:54] thank you Ed for bringing this in
[00:48:56] it was a genuine joy to watch
[00:48:58] and I'd like to watch some more
[00:49:00] I would definitely be watching some more
[00:49:02] and yeah well thank you for kind of bringing me back
[00:49:04] to it as it were because it was
[00:49:06] it's been a while but it's been good
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