Christmas Films Special

[00:00:00] Merry Christmas, you filthy animal, and a Happy New Year.

[00:00:09] Hello and welcome to the Christmas edition of Who Moved the Tortoise. I'm Kate Dooley.

[00:00:14] And I'm Alex Hemingway.

[00:00:16] And today we have a cod...

[00:00:19] We have a codpiece filled with the joys of Christmas.

[00:00:21] We have a codpiece full of Christmas joy. Get your mouth around this, folks.

[00:00:26] And today we have a podcast filled with the joys of Christmas film and TV.

[00:00:31] Guests, past and present, reveal their own Christmas classics.

[00:00:34] We talk about our own favourites and we compare to the nation's favourites.

[00:00:38] So, Alex, how should we kick it off?

[00:00:40] Well, first of all, we're recording this five days before Christmas.

[00:00:45] Do you have a pre-Christmas sort of routine of an order in which you watch your favourites?

[00:00:50] And what have you watched already? What are you saving?

[00:00:52] You know, what are the big hitters that you're saving?

[00:00:55] Great question. So Die Hard is in there.

[00:00:57] And the Gavin and Stacey. We try and watch the whole of Gavin and Stacey before the Christmas special.

[00:01:05] Because this year is the final Christmas special, which we're very excited about.

[00:01:09] We caught Home Alone the other day and I'd forgotten how genius it is.

[00:01:16] Go, how about you?

[00:01:17] Well, we have a tradition of trying to watch one Christmas film a night from the 1st of December onwards.

[00:01:24] And I'm pretty sure we've succeeded in the past. It's got a lot harder in recent years.

[00:01:29] And I would say we're probably at something like a 66, 70% success rate this year.

[00:01:35] Wow.

[00:01:36] But, you know, and we've already done some of the ones you've mentioned, like Home Alone is always a must and stands up really well.

[00:01:43] Like Nativity, kind of quite silly, quite cheesy British film.

[00:01:47] Love Actually?

[00:01:48] Love Actually?

[00:01:49] Well, no, because I refuse to watch Love Actually because I think it's an abomination.

[00:01:53] But that is another matter entirely.

[00:01:55] Oh, wow. That's a whole other podcast worth. Okay.

[00:01:58] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:01:59] I mean, it puts me in a significant minority.

[00:02:02] But watched a new one last night, Fred Claus, which has got a brilliant cast.

[00:02:07] The reviews are terrible.

[00:02:09] If you look at Rotten Tomatoes, etc.

[00:02:10] It reviews terribly, but we thought we'll give it a go and actually rather enjoyed it.

[00:02:13] But it's got Paul Giamatti as Santa Claus, which can only be a good thing.

[00:02:17] But for me, it's about saving the real big beasts for nearer the big day.

[00:02:22] So Muppets Christmas Carol, which, as you know, is the pinnacle for me.

[00:02:27] And then there are a few TV Christmas specials as well.

[00:02:31] So the League of Gentlemen Christmas special, which is a proper Christmas horror from, I mean, it must be the best part of 25 years old now.

[00:02:40] Also, the Blackadder Christmas special is a real classic.

[00:02:43] And maybe the pinnacle, which is the Father's Head Christmas special.

[00:02:48] Wow.

[00:02:49] That'll be a Christmas Eve one that I'll probably end up watching on my own because no one seems to like it.

[00:02:55] But that's just me.

[00:02:56] Yeah.

[00:02:57] And would you try and get new ones in every year?

[00:03:00] It's a bit of a mixture.

[00:03:01] I mean, if there's something really good that gets recommended, then yes.

[00:03:05] So like last year, for example, The Holdovers was released in the UK over the Christmas period.

[00:03:10] I think before it was released in America.

[00:03:13] And that's a fantastic film in its own right and also a really great Christmas film.

[00:03:18] Baldi Matti again.

[00:03:19] And I can highly recommend that.

[00:03:21] One of my favourite Christmas films of all time is actually relatively recent, and that's The Man Who Invented Christmas.

[00:03:26] I also really loved the Michael Sheen film for, I think it was for Sky, which was Last Train to Christmas, which is sort of quite a powerful drama.

[00:03:36] But with a kind of a slight science fiction element to it as well.

[00:03:39] Oh, cool.

[00:03:40] So yeah, new ones where possible.

[00:03:42] I think what you find is that there's a huge glut of absolutely awful carbon copy boilerplate Christmas films that are all released en masse in December.

[00:03:52] So you have to wade through all of those as well.

[00:03:55] To find the gems.

[00:03:57] Well, shall we see what some of our guests past and present have enjoyed?

[00:04:04] And then we can come back, maybe you can regroup and see if there are any winners, losers, and whether that kind of tallies with the great and the good and what everyone else thinks.

[00:04:17] Yeah.

[00:04:18] Okay, let's get to it.

[00:04:20] What is your favourite Christmas film, your essential Christmas film, and why do you love it so much and why is it so good?

[00:04:29] Um, I would say my favourite Christmas film is, it's a toss up between Elf, because I absolutely love Will Ferrell generally, or Muppets Christmas Carol.

[00:04:43] But there's a very nostalgic part of me that's saying Muppets Christmas Carol.

[00:04:49] A, it's hilarious, but it's a film that I've been watching since I was about 13 with my sister.

[00:04:54] We all laugh at the same jokes.

[00:04:56] We quote the same parts of it.

[00:05:01] And yeah, it's just become a bit of a, a bit of a, what do you call it, a tradition in my family.

[00:05:08] I'm trying to get my son into it.

[00:05:10] It's, there are parts of it that are quite scary for a five-year-old.

[00:05:13] Yes.

[00:05:13] But I am, uh, I'm trying to force it down his throat in the most polite way possible.

[00:05:18] Um, but no, I love it.

[00:05:20] It's such a good film.

[00:05:21] What, why do you, what do you think is the key to it?

[00:05:23] It's, it's brilliant.

[00:05:24] It's a really refreshing take on a very tried and tested subject matter.

[00:05:30] You know, that, you know, almost every year there's a new version of Scrooge that comes out.

[00:05:34] Or a Christmas Carol.

[00:05:36] And it broadly speaking, the kind of, the USP is, oh, we're doing it in 3D or, oh, this is an animated version.

[00:05:44] And they're all broadly speaking the same.

[00:05:46] And I think I had seen a couple of, of versions of it before Muppets Christmas Carol came out.

[00:05:52] But when it did, it blew me away.

[00:05:55] And, you know, I already love the Muppets.

[00:05:58] Their sense of humor is, is, is right up my strata.

[00:06:02] And to hear, to, to see that kind of tried and tested format completely changed.

[00:06:09] Um, and I don't like musicals.

[00:06:12] I know you do, Alex, but I don't like musicals.

[00:06:14] I hate them.

[00:06:14] But this was a massive exception to that rule.

[00:06:18] I love it.

[00:06:18] Every song I can sing.

[00:06:22] May I welcome you to Christmas morning.

[00:06:36] It's in the singing of the street corner choir.

[00:06:39] It's going home and getting warm by the fire.

[00:06:42] It's true wherever you find love.

[00:06:45] It feels like Christmas.

[00:06:47] A cup of kindness that we share with another.

[00:06:50] A sweet reunion with a friend or a brother.

[00:06:53] In all the places you find love.

[00:06:55] It feels like Christmas.

[00:06:58] It is the season of the heart.

[00:07:03] A special time of caring.

[00:07:05] The ways of love made clear.

[00:07:11] The season of the spirit.

[00:07:13] The message, if we hear it.

[00:07:16] Is make it last all year.

[00:07:20] I don't know whether you know this great fact, but as I understand it,

[00:07:23] someone has studied every kind of film adaptation of A Christmas Carol.

[00:07:28] And the film that is most faithful to the book based on direct lifts of dialogue is A Muppet's Christmas Carol.

[00:07:37] It has more lines of Dickens' own hand than any other adaptation.

[00:07:42] Wow.

[00:07:43] No way.

[00:07:43] Even Heat Wave.

[00:07:46] Hey, boss.

[00:07:46] Tell him, Mr.

[00:07:47] Come on.

[00:07:48] Come on.

[00:07:48] Let's do it now.

[00:07:49] Come on.

[00:07:57] Come on.

[00:07:58] Bookkeep.

[00:07:59] All of our pens have turned to inkcicles.

[00:08:01] Our assets are frozen.

[00:08:03] How would the bookkeepers like to be suddenly?

[00:08:09] Island in the sun.

[00:08:11] Oi, oi.

[00:08:12] I believe you can raise them once again, Mr. Scrooge.

[00:08:17] I would never have guessed that.

[00:08:19] And it, yeah, makes me love it even more, I suppose.

[00:08:23] The fact that you can make something so fresh and distinctive whilst still staying so traditional and true to the original text is incredible.

[00:08:34] I didn't even, yeah.

[00:08:35] Wow.

[00:08:36] I read a brilliant thing the other day.

[00:08:37] So one of the things that's always held up as why Muppets Christmas Carol is so great is the fact that Michael Caine plays it absolutely dead straight.

[00:08:49] And I read a, there was a comparison with Muppets Treasure Island.

[00:08:55] And the argument was, and let me get this right, that Michael Caine plays his role like all the other Muppets are human actors.

[00:09:06] Whereas in Treasure Island, Tim Curry pretends to be a Muppet and treats everyone else like a Muppet.

[00:09:14] And they're both brilliant films and they're both amazing performances.

[00:09:17] But like Michael Caine's, Michael Caine is straight out of Royal Shakespeare Company basically, isn't it?

[00:09:23] He's playing it absolutely dead straight.

[00:09:26] Exactly.

[00:09:26] And I think, I think that's the only way to do it for something like that, you know, treasure, Muppets Treasure Island, you can have a bit more fun with.

[00:09:34] But yeah, with Dickens, I think that's the only way that he could have done it, I think.

[00:09:40] You know, by treating it with the gravitas that it deserved really.

[00:09:44] And allowing the Muppets to create the comedy.

[00:09:47] They create the magic, don't they?

[00:09:49] Yeah, you're right.

[00:09:50] Yeah, they do.

[00:09:51] Because it's a really magical story, but it's deeply human.

[00:09:54] All the values at the core of it are just deeply human.

[00:09:58] And so you kind of, yeah, you need the dark and the light.

[00:10:01] No, you're right.

[00:10:02] To get both.

[00:10:03] No, it's brilliant.

[00:10:05] I'm going to have to tell my sister that fact.

[00:10:08] Because, you know, we grew up watching it together.

[00:10:10] I don't think she'll believe me.

[00:10:12] Send me the link.

[00:10:13] I will.

[00:10:14] It's even some of the jokes that you think are classic Muppety jokes are actually Dickens jokes.

[00:10:20] He's just that good.

[00:10:22] Good old Dickens.

[00:10:22] Yeah, great.

[00:10:23] Can you answer the question of favourite Christmas film and justify it?

[00:10:29] Damn it.

[00:10:30] Justify it to her.

[00:10:31] Christ.

[00:10:32] What Christmas films do we watch?

[00:10:35] Can you name some?

[00:10:37] Die Hard.

[00:10:38] No, we don't know.

[00:10:39] I haven't actually seen any of the Die Hard.

[00:10:40] National Lampoon.

[00:10:42] Elf.

[00:10:43] Muppets Christmas Carol.

[00:10:45] 24th.

[00:10:46] Jingle All The Way.

[00:10:47] Miracle on 34th Street.

[00:10:49] That's it.

[00:10:49] Whatever it is.

[00:10:50] Original and remake.

[00:10:52] Oh my gosh.

[00:10:54] What are some of the cartoony ones?

[00:10:56] Animation.

[00:10:58] Oh, Home Alone is also.

[00:10:59] Oh, Home Alone.

[00:11:00] Home Alone is also on.

[00:11:01] No, I'd have to say Elf.

[00:11:03] Once you said Elf, I was like, yeah, that's it.

[00:11:04] Absolutely.

[00:11:05] I always forget that that's a Christmas movie for some reason, even though it literally

[00:11:08] is about an elf on Christmas.

[00:11:10] But Will Ferrell's so good in that.

[00:11:12] And it's, again, I think anything about somebody who's overly enthusiastic where I just picture

[00:11:18] him on that scene where he's like, somebody's, is he working in like a department store as

[00:11:23] an elf?

[00:11:24] And they're saying, oh, so Santa's coming.

[00:11:25] And he goes, oh, Santa's coming here.

[00:11:27] And people are like, yeah, the guy who's organizing the shifts is like, yes, yes, Santa is coming.

[00:11:32] And he goes, Santa!

[00:11:34] And just screams.

[00:11:35] It's just, that's exactly something I would do.

[00:11:39] Probably not about Santa, but, you know, about like cinnamon rolls or something.

[00:11:44] It's time for an announcement.

[00:11:45] Okay.

[00:11:46] Okay, people.

[00:11:47] Tomorrow morning, 10 a.m., Santa's coming to town.

[00:11:50] Santa!

[00:11:52] Oh my God!

[00:11:54] Santa here?

[00:11:55] I know him.

[00:11:57] I know him.

[00:11:59] So Elf is always held up as a prime example of the fact that comedy films never seem to get

[00:12:05] nominated or win Oscars.

[00:12:07] They don't get nominations.

[00:12:08] They don't win them.

[00:12:09] And Elf is held up as the prime example that Will Ferrell should have had at least an Oscar

[00:12:14] nomination for that performance.

[00:12:16] Absolutely.

[00:12:16] Yeah.

[00:12:17] Not even a question.

[00:12:19] So good.

[00:12:20] Hopefully they made a lot of money out of it, so.

[00:12:23] Oh yeah, I don't feel sorry for him.

[00:12:24] Who cares?

[00:12:26] I mean, it's hard to feel pity at that point.

[00:12:28] The wards, the schmalls.

[00:12:29] Give us the money.

[00:12:30] He probably has a couple that he's gotten.

[00:12:32] Has he ever won an Oscar?

[00:12:33] No.

[00:12:34] Will Ferrell.

[00:12:34] No, I can't imagine he has.

[00:12:35] Yeah, comedy again.

[00:12:37] Comedy needs like a section.

[00:12:39] It does.

[00:12:40] There needs to be awards for it.

[00:12:42] The office would get so many awards.

[00:12:45] The American office.

[00:12:46] I think there's an argument that actually to do comedy well is harder than to do anything

[00:12:52] else well.

[00:12:53] Oh God, yeah.

[00:12:53] And yet it isn't recognized in quite the same way.

[00:12:56] Oh, I had in middle school when I did a lot of like musical theater and stuff growing

[00:13:01] up.

[00:13:02] And in middle school we had this drama class.

[00:13:05] And every now and then we would do improv days.

[00:13:09] And obviously those were like the really funny days.

[00:13:12] But combine that with the fact that you're just like just turning 13.

[00:13:16] You're really awkward.

[00:13:17] You really want to be, you know, make friends with people.

[00:13:20] Or I have PTSD from that.

[00:13:22] Like it's just, there's nothing worse than being on a stage thinking that you've done

[00:13:25] something really funny and not a single laugh.

[00:13:29] It still haunts me to this day.

[00:13:31] So comedy is really difficult.

[00:13:33] And it's not something that I ever want to try again soon.

[00:13:37] What is your favorite Christmas film?

[00:13:44] We've had that reaction quite a lot actually.

[00:13:46] That's brutal.

[00:13:47] It's a big topic, isn't it?

[00:13:48] It's like the most difficult question you've ever been asked.

[00:13:51] I know.

[00:13:51] Because it's like, well, you're back into the whole die hard thing, aren't you?

[00:13:55] Like, you know, there's a Christmassy scene in Ghostbusters as well.

[00:14:00] It's like, does that count?

[00:14:01] Okay, I'm going to go pure.

[00:14:02] I'm going to go pure Christmas film.

[00:14:03] It's got to be The Muppets Christmas Carol.

[00:14:06] Yes.

[00:14:07] That's Alex's.

[00:14:08] Fantastic.

[00:14:08] That's mine.

[00:14:09] There's no cheeses for us, Mises.

[00:14:12] Which I often cite as the greatest line in all of cinema.

[00:14:18] Don't ask him for a favor because his nastiness increases.

[00:14:23] No crushed and bread for those in need.

[00:14:26] No cheeses for a cheese.

[00:14:27] Can you articulate sort of what it is about that film, actually,

[00:14:30] that you love so much?

[00:14:32] It's just joyous, isn't it?

[00:14:33] The music's amazing.

[00:14:35] It's one of those films that anyone can watch it.

[00:14:39] There's enough in there in terms of the jokes and things that they have that, you know,

[00:14:44] there's enough sort of adult nods and the kids really love it too.

[00:14:47] And generation after generation of Millards, we watch that every Christmas without fail.

[00:14:52] And it's just amazing seeing our kids, my sister's kids, they're still getting the same things out of it that we did back when it first came out.

[00:15:01] And so are my mum and dad and my grandparents before them.

[00:15:05] And I think that there's very few films that can bring you together like that, you know, but that's one of them.

[00:15:11] Oh, great.

[00:15:11] Well, you gave the right answer.

[00:15:13] The right answer is Christmas Carol.

[00:15:16] Demo's Mr. Heartless.

[00:15:18] Demo's Mr. Cruel.

[00:15:20] He never gives.

[00:15:22] He only takes.

[00:15:23] He lets his hunger rule.

[00:15:25] But work is being off.

[00:15:33] Because Scrooge is getting worse.

[00:15:35] Every day in every way.

[00:15:37] Scrooge is getting worse.

[00:15:40] My favourite Christmas film is without doubt Chitty Chitty Bang Bang.

[00:15:44] It's so much fun.

[00:15:46] Some great songs like Posh sung by Lionel Jeffries and from the ashes of disaster comes the phoenix of success,

[00:15:54] which is great and truly scrumptious, very sweet.

[00:15:58] But also has the controversial performance by Lionel Helpman as the child catcher who terrified me as a boy and actually still does.

[00:16:08] It's a great Christmas watch and I love it.

[00:16:14] Children, where are you?

[00:16:19] I know you're here somewhere.

[00:16:25] I've lots of lovely goodies for you today.

[00:16:42] What's your favourite Christmas film?

[00:16:44] And why?

[00:16:46] Oliver.

[00:16:46] Oliver.

[00:16:48] The musical.

[00:16:51] Yeah.

[00:16:51] Why?

[00:16:52] Because it's evocative of my childhood, I suppose.

[00:16:57] But also it's got some cracking tunes.

[00:17:00] I love it.

[00:17:00] And it's got, you know, it's got social comment.

[00:17:03] It's got violence against women.

[00:17:04] It's got the works.

[00:17:06] It's got everything I love to watch.

[00:17:08] No, no, no.

[00:17:11] Child labour.

[00:17:12] No, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:17:14] It's only because I was talking to my daughter about it.

[00:17:18] He's 18, just about to go off and do English at university.

[00:17:21] And I said, oh, it's all a bit sad.

[00:17:23] And it's like, no, no, there is really deep violence in that musical.

[00:17:27] It's not just all jolly jolly.

[00:17:29] There is some really harrowing moments.

[00:17:32] Yeah, light and shade.

[00:17:34] Good storytelling.

[00:17:35] You need the funny bit to make the sad sad.

[00:17:47] It's not just a word.

[00:18:28] I thought those two choices were really interesting.

[00:18:50] Because I think they reflect something that we don't have so much anymore.

[00:18:54] Which I remember from sort of childhood.

[00:18:56] And that is the idea of the big blockbuster film on Christmas.

[00:19:02] You know, squeezed into the Christmas schedules and it being a big deal.

[00:19:05] You know, it might have been a Bond film or...

[00:19:09] Indiana Jones.

[00:19:10] Indiana Jones, exactly.

[00:19:11] Harry Potter now.

[00:19:12] Yeah, yeah.

[00:19:13] And I think there is that association with Christmas,

[00:19:16] as we've seen from Tim and Simon,

[00:19:19] that there are films that evoke Christmas for people

[00:19:22] that maybe aren't Christmas films at all for that reason.

[00:19:24] And that probably explains my sometimes divisive film of Die Hard.

[00:19:30] That would be my Christmas film.

[00:19:32] Because even though it's not really about Christmas,

[00:19:36] it's set at Christmas.

[00:19:38] And it's just, for me, that film is all about Christmas.

[00:19:43] Yes, it's about family in a roundabout way, isn't it?

[00:19:46] I mean, it is...

[00:19:47] There is a...

[00:19:48] I mean, there have been whole tomes written about whether it's a Christmas film or not.

[00:19:51] And I think I'd probably sit in the camp of not.

[00:19:54] But I think I'm probably in a minority there.

[00:19:57] I'm not sure.

[00:19:58] Great film.

[00:19:58] I think even Bruce Willis, I think, has said it's not a Christmas film.

[00:20:04] Interesting.

[00:20:04] So you're not in a minority at all.

[00:20:06] Yeah, shall we see what some more of our guests have thought?

[00:20:09] Because it looks like...

[00:20:10] Let's do it.

[00:20:11] Muppet's Christmas Carol is doing rather well.

[00:20:13] Well, suits me.

[00:20:17] My favourite Christmas movie of all time is Elf.

[00:20:21] Now, that's largely because Buddy the Elf has the same energy and enthusiasm for Christmas

[00:20:27] as I do at this time of year.

[00:20:29] I get very, very excited.

[00:20:30] And also because I think it's just a beautiful little story of self-discovery and being yourself.

[00:20:35] And I think it's really uplifting to watch at this time of year.

[00:20:38] And finally, I'm also slightly obsessed with the scene where they trash the toy store,

[00:20:43] which they basically had to film in one take because they never could have afforded to

[00:20:47] rebuild the whole thing and do it again.

[00:20:49] And I'm very, very impressed that they managed to make it so good with just one take to play with.

[00:20:53] I hope if you watch Elf at this time of year that you enjoy it.

[00:20:57] My runner-up, my secret number two spot, which is a very close run thing,

[00:21:00] is The Muppet's Christmas Carol because, you know,

[00:21:02] Michael Caine plays it as seriously as he possibly can,

[00:21:05] even though he's surrounded by Muppets.

[00:21:08] Yeah, so if you watch either of those,

[00:21:10] I hope you enjoy and a very Merry Christmas to everyone.

[00:21:16] Who the heck are you?

[00:21:17] What are you talking about? I'm Santa Claus.

[00:21:19] No, you're not.

[00:21:21] Oh, why, of course I am.

[00:21:24] You're Santa.

[00:21:27] What song did I sing for you on your birthday this year?

[00:21:31] Happy birthday, of course.

[00:21:35] So how old are you, son?

[00:21:37] Black.

[00:21:38] You're a big boy. What's your name?

[00:21:40] Paul.

[00:21:41] And what can I get you for Christmas?

[00:21:42] Don't tell him what you want. He's a liar.

[00:21:45] Let the kid talk.

[00:21:46] You disgust me. How can you live with yourself?

[00:21:49] Just cool it, Zippy.

[00:21:51] You sit on a throne of lies.

[00:21:53] Look, I'm not kidding.

[00:21:54] You're a fake.

[00:21:55] I'm a fake?

[00:21:56] Yes.

[00:21:56] How'd you like to be dead?

[00:21:58] Huh?

[00:21:59] No, he's kidding.

[00:22:01] You stink.

[00:22:02] I think you're gonna have a good Christmas, all right?

[00:22:04] You smell like beef and cheese. You don't smell like Santa.

[00:22:07] Okay.

[00:22:14] This is the most serious, difficult question you're ever gonna answer.

[00:22:29] What is your favourite Christmas film and why?

[00:22:33] Oh, that is brilliant.

[00:22:36] It's National Lampoon's Christmas Vacation.

[00:22:39] Oh my God, it's the same as my husband.

[00:22:40] I haven't seen it.

[00:22:42] Right, go on. Why?

[00:22:43] I mean, it is a film that I do watch every year and I probably do try and make the family watch it.

[00:22:48] And I'm not sure that Chevy Chase's brand of humour probably has aged.

[00:22:53] But it is very funny and it does tick all the Christmas boxes.

[00:22:58] He has the family that come and then he does the lights.

[00:23:00] And I don't know, it does feel like the perfect kind of Christmas movie.

[00:23:05] Oh, what?

[00:23:06] A Clark and a Santy car.

[00:23:09] No.

[00:23:10] It's the Christmas star.

[00:23:12] And that's all that matters tonight.

[00:23:16] Not bonuses or gifts or turkeys or trees.

[00:23:21] See, kids?

[00:23:23] It means something different to everybody.

[00:23:27] Now I know what it means to me.

[00:23:31] That ain't the friggin' Christmas star, Grizz.

[00:23:34] It's a lighter in the sewage treatment plant.

[00:23:37] Sewer gas.

[00:23:41] Don't drop that!

[00:24:07] I mean, I've chosen National Anthem's Christmas Vacation.

[00:24:10] It is the one that I always go to.

[00:24:12] I haven't yet watched It's a Wonderful Life with my kids.

[00:24:15] And that is a bit of a...

[00:24:16] I really...

[00:24:17] I do feel like that is an amazing Christmas film.

[00:24:19] But I am intrigued as to whether now that's the right time for them to engage with a

[00:24:24] quite slow-paced black and white film from the 40s.

[00:24:26] But it is amazing.

[00:24:28] And then just to sort of...

[00:24:30] I think that the kind of the film that is often kind of controversially not considered a Christmas movie,

[00:24:36] but has a lot of Christmas elements is Die Hard.

[00:24:38] I mean, that's mine.

[00:24:39] And again, I feel like that kind of like sleigh bell part of the soundtrack

[00:24:44] and just the Christmas-ness that's just in the DNA of the film,

[00:24:48] that I think makes it kind of inherently something that you want to watch come December.

[00:24:52] Right?

[00:24:53] What's yours, Alex?

[00:24:54] I have two, actually.

[00:24:57] One is a bit random and not that many people particularly know it.

[00:25:01] And it's quite recent, which is The Man Who Invented Christmas,

[00:25:04] which is...

[00:25:05] It's Dan Stevens plays Charles Dickens.

[00:25:08] And it's the story of Charles Dickens' struggle to write a Christmas carol.

[00:25:13] And it essentially involves the retelling of a Christmas carol through his attempts to write it.

[00:25:18] And I love that.

[00:25:18] That sounds great.

[00:25:19] It's great.

[00:25:19] It's really good.

[00:25:20] I haven't seen it, but I'm aware of it.

[00:25:21] It is really, really good.

[00:25:22] It's only probably four or five years old.

[00:25:24] But the best Christmas film by far is Muppet's Christmas Carol.

[00:25:29] The Marleys were dead to begin with.

[00:25:32] Oh, pardon me?

[00:25:33] That's how the story begins, Rizzo.

[00:25:35] The Marleys were dead to begin with.

[00:25:38] As dead as a doornail.

[00:25:40] It's a good beginning.

[00:25:41] It's creepy and kind of spooky.

[00:25:43] Thank you, Rizzo.

[00:25:44] You're welcome, Mr Dickens.

[00:25:46] In life, the Marleys had been business partners

[00:25:49] with a shrewd moneylender named Ebenezer Scrooge.

[00:25:53] You will meet him as he comes around that corner.

[00:25:56] Where?

[00:25:57] There.

[00:25:58] When?

[00:25:59] Now.

[00:26:01] So from our small panel of experts, expert experts,

[00:26:06] in science and TV film,

[00:26:08] we have every right to judge Christmas films, obviously,

[00:26:11] I think it sounds like Muppet's Christmas Carol is the winner.

[00:26:14] That's our favourite Christmas film.

[00:26:16] Well, I'm not going to argue with that

[00:26:18] because it's my favourite Christmas film.

[00:26:20] I'm literally counting down the days till I can watch it.

[00:26:23] Why not just watch that every single night in the one after Christmas?

[00:26:27] I do.

[00:26:28] Don't want to ruin it.

[00:26:30] Shall we compare our very unscientific results

[00:26:32] with one of the thousands of charts and top tens and top twenties

[00:26:37] that exist out there?

[00:26:38] Absolutely.

[00:26:38] I've pulled up a few, but let's go for IMDb.

[00:26:42] Coming in at number 10 from 1984 is Gremlins.

[00:26:49] Number nine is the original Miracle on 34th Street from 1947.

[00:26:55] Oh, wow.

[00:26:56] Now, I like both versions, actually.

[00:26:58] I don't know.

[00:26:58] Are you a fan?

[00:26:59] I haven't seen either.

[00:27:01] Oh, you must.

[00:27:02] You must.

[00:27:03] This is where we suddenly realise

[00:27:04] I'm not a big Christmas film buff like you, Alex.

[00:27:09] Oh, and here we go.

[00:27:10] Number eight is one that has briefly been mentioned.

[00:27:12] Which I have never seen,

[00:27:13] which is National Lampoon's Christmas Vacation from 1989.

[00:27:17] We're getting into some heavy hitters now.

[00:27:20] So number seven is Elf,

[00:27:22] which I'm surprised isn't higher.

[00:27:25] In other lists, you'll often see it floating around the top two or three.

[00:27:29] But it is just, I think it's a perfect film.

[00:27:33] So number six is an old one.

[00:27:35] And that is Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer from 1964,

[00:27:39] which I think is the stop motion animation.

[00:27:42] Right, number five.

[00:27:44] I have no...

[00:27:46] I just...

[00:27:46] It just doesn't ring any bells for me at all.

[00:27:48] And that's A Christmas Story from 1983.

[00:27:51] Oh, yeah.

[00:27:52] No idea.

[00:27:52] Yeah.

[00:27:53] Which I know nothing about.

[00:27:54] I shall read you the blurb,

[00:27:56] see whether this floats your boat.

[00:27:59] In the 1940s, a young boy named Ralphie Parker

[00:28:01] attempts to convince his parents, teacher and Santa Claus

[00:28:04] that a Red Rider Range 200-shot BB gun

[00:28:07] really is the perfect Christmas gift.

[00:28:11] So there we go.

[00:28:12] Wow.

[00:28:12] I mean, that's the fifth greatest Christmas film of all time.

[00:28:14] Yeah, sounds it.

[00:28:17] Number four is my dad's favourite Christmas film.

[00:28:20] And I know that he watches it every Christmas day without fail.

[00:28:23] And that is the Alice to Sim Christmas Carol from 1951.

[00:28:30] Wow.

[00:28:30] Which is fantastic.

[00:28:31] I mean, it is fantastic.

[00:28:32] I still think Muppets Christmas Carol is the better version of the story.

[00:28:36] Yeah.

[00:28:36] I will stand by that.

[00:28:37] But as a classic Dickens adaptation, it is great.

[00:28:41] Number three, Home Alone.

[00:28:45] Yes.

[00:28:46] Yeah, I mean, it's a great film.

[00:28:47] Yeah, it just sort of, it's a film that sort of achieves everything it sets out to do.

[00:28:51] I just think it sort of sits in that perfect film category

[00:28:54] where you kind of sit back and think, would I change anything there?

[00:28:57] I don't think so.

[00:28:58] Okay.

[00:29:00] Well, I can see number two and number one.

[00:29:02] And the first shocking thing is that Muppets Christmas Carol isn't in either spot.

[00:29:07] And I'm going to scroll down and find out where it actually sits on this list.

[00:29:11] Who is voting for this?

[00:29:12] I disagree with IMDb.

[00:29:13] So Muppets Christmas Carol doesn't even fall in the top 50, according to this list.

[00:29:21] No, that's not a camping.

[00:29:22] Yeah, there's got to be something wrong there.

[00:29:23] Anyway, number two, Die Hard.

[00:29:25] Yeah, love it.

[00:29:25] I mean, you may have lost our internal poll, but you kind of win the moral.

[00:29:31] High ground.

[00:29:32] Yeah, yeah.

[00:29:33] I love that.

[00:29:34] That's the only ground I want to win.

[00:29:36] And number one, and this often pops out as number one, is It's a Wonderful Life.

[00:29:42] Which is a great film.

[00:29:43] So that's the top 10.

[00:29:45] And I'm going to now go and write to IMDb and work out where enough Muppets Christmas Carol isn't on that list.

[00:29:51] And in all this, no one has mentioned another Christmas gem, the Royal Institution Christmas Lectures.

[00:29:59] They've been going for 199 years, engaging people with the latest cutting edge science.

[00:30:05] So many of us watched as kids, got us excited about science.

[00:30:08] And I feel like there's something we should talk about to do with that.

[00:30:12] And what's that, Kate?

[00:30:13] What could you possibly be thinking of?

[00:30:15] Well, excitingly, we're going to do a podcast at the Royal Institution, celebrating the 200 years anniversary of these lectures,

[00:30:25] which started many, many years ago with Michael Faraday.

[00:30:29] On the 9th of February, put it in your diaries, go buy tickets, they're on their website.

[00:30:33] What better people to talk about it than you and me?

[00:30:37] I know, we're the perfect people to celebrate.

[00:30:40] It's worth pointing out that there will be a panel of experts.

[00:30:45] I mean, I've watched it.

[00:30:47] No, I've actually worked on it.

[00:30:49] Oh, you have worked on it, yeah.

[00:30:51] 2005, I think it was.

[00:30:53] Professor Lloyd Peck did the Christmas lectures on Antarctica.

[00:30:57] And yeah, we're getting a panel of people together.

[00:31:00] Helen Chertsky, who Alex has worked with many times, fabulous presenter.

[00:31:04] And ex-Christmas lecturer.

[00:31:06] David Dugan, who is the chairman of Windfall Films, who have been the brilliant partner with the Royal Institution,

[00:31:11] who have created the televised lectures for many years now.

[00:31:16] And we're going to have some few other special guests, people who have been in front of the scenes, behind the scenes,

[00:31:22] telling us all sorts of wonderful stories about the lectures and what they've meant to them.

[00:31:27] Yeah.

[00:31:27] So go to the website, Royal Institution, look for Who Moved the Tortoise, and we are there.

[00:31:31] Yeah, I can scarcely believe it.

[00:31:34] A live show.

[00:31:35] We'd better get planning, Kate, because February the 9th feels like it's just around the corner.

[00:31:39] Now you've made it public.

[00:31:42] I know.

[00:31:42] Oh my gosh, we actually have to do it.

[00:31:45] I'm excited.

[00:31:45] It's going to be great.

[00:31:46] It's going to be a super fun night.

[00:31:48] So please get in touch, come along, buy tickets, tell everyone about it.

[00:31:52] Yeah, tickets available on the Royal Institution website.

[00:31:54] Yeah.

[00:31:55] Keep the change, you filthy animal.

[00:32:00] Mindless Wittering Production.

[00:32:02] To buy tickets and find out more about our live recording at the Royal Institution,

[00:32:08] go to www.rigb.org, click on What's On, and scroll down to Sunday the 9th of February.

[00:32:17] Tickets are £7 for Royal Institution members and patrons, £10 for concessions, and £16 for everyone else.

[00:32:24] Thanks for supporting us this year.

[00:32:26] Kate and I will be back with more new episodes in early 2025.

[00:32:31] Merry Christmas.